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June 24, 2007

Comments

Eureka

It's a shame what crafting has turned into - or had turned into before I left the game in favor of real life adventure. The crafting system that I really liked the best was Everquest II's. You really had to think and develop skill in order to craft a good product. But even there, you had to level in order to farm the ingredients that you needed in the landmasses where you could gather them, or you had to grind to afford the items that you needed. I have yet to play a game with a truly excellent system.

Yet for me, I'm tired of killing monsters. Maybe it's because of what real life has wrought, but I want to build worlds and make them better, not fight. And a crafting alternative to empower others would be so very relaxing and nice.

Like you, I was really excited to try LOTR's farming craft. But it was impossible; the craft was so bugged and elements were removed for now. What a shame.

Kanthalos

I completely agree with this type of crafting system. Crafting in WoW is a total drag as you simply gather the mats and wait for the bar to fill. There is no skill involved and nothing interesting about it in the least. I didn't even bother raising my crafting skills post-BC because while the rewards were pretty nice, I just didn't feel like spending hours on mindless crafting. While I never really got into the crafting in EQ2 or LotRO, I respect them and know that they are much more involved and interactive, and I will probably try them out at some point.

Saylah

One of the things I was looking forward to in Vanguard was the crafting system. I planned on building ships or at least, one of the classes that supported ship building.

I would love to see WOW crafting become less grind oriented but I'm not expecting an expansion of interactivity along the lines of EQ2. My personal opinion is that the average WOW player isn't actually interested in having that kind of crafting experience. I can't recall a single forum post asking for anything remotely resembling EQ2 or LOTRO crafting.

What I'm inclined to think is that the interactive, more immersive and semi role-building (as opposed to role-pleying) gaming experiend, isn't what the average audience for WOW craves in a game. :-( Blizzard hit 8 million by tapping into the more base needs of a wider group of people, whose wants are unfortunately, more surface level than my own. And I'm not expecting WAR to be any different in this regard. I'm looking forward to WAR for the change of scenary and a renewed vigor for leveling and outfitting a character.

Wolfgangdoom

Now that I have leveled my priest to 70, there have been a few times where I have debated changing from alchemy/herbalism over to herbalism/tailoring just so I can craft a primal mooncloth chest piece, but I can't bring myself to do it since I enjoy being able to supply my own pots,xmutes,ect. With that being said, vendors who produce items for mats would be nice, but I'm not sure the playerbase as a whole would respond well to such a system.

By removing the player element, you also eliminate the leet players from making thousands of gold by being one of the first to acquire new enchants like mongoose, battlemaster, sunfire, ect.

WoW's crafting system may not be the best, but it's certainly better than nothing, and it's a nice way to go afk and still produce something viable. Usually when I craft I gather enough mats to make what I expect to use for a week then click create all and grab a snack.

Eureka

The Saga of Ryzom actually had an interesting system. Have any of you tried that game? It got tedious to me, with time, mainly because the game did not grow as I did, but you had to think to craft, and you could choose different subingredients to craft a color and a style that you wanted. Each combination would have different benefits, so that you could make your character very unique.

Saylah

I think what Wolf said he likes about crafting in WOW; being able to click it a go, is what the average player wants. They don't want to actually manufacture the item, so I don't see any point in having us pretend to do so. And I would like the affect that leet players can't dominate the market because they were the first to be able to farm a particular recipe, lets religate that to having farmed the rare mat instead. They would still be the first or only in possession, but have less opportunity to hold the market because once they've acquired it for themselves, the most they can to is sell the mats to others. They can make a hefty profit from that but I think it's more likely that others would be able to farm the same mat versus getting and having that recipe.

No, I didnt try much in Ryzom. It was to mouse/click oriented for my tastes. By the time I was bored and looking for something to do again, they were in financial troubles.

What you described is basically the approach Guild Wars takes to crafting. There are no actual professions, you gather materials from drops or salvage them from items and when you have enough, the NPC crafters will make you armor/weapons out of it. I personally much prefer that approach to WoW's.

Saylah

Oh, that's right. I'd forgotten how GW did it. That's a bit sparce for me though. I would always want gathering professions. It lends a little RP to it, and it allows players to still differntiate themselves from one another.

I've probably said this too much here, but EQ2 still reigns supreme for me when it comes to crafting. LOTRO seemed close but quicker. However, I've read from players that it's a huge money-sink and that the economy is very off-kilter.

HunterMan72

I still have an unopened GW box on my desk at home. I have debated playing it just for a change of scenery from WoW. Is it worth trying out, or will I be disappointed? In regards to the professions, I am a gatherer, pure and simple. I have tried nearly every profession in WoW at some point, but the crafting professions are nearly all money sinks. I need money for too many other things in the game, not to mention the time constraints I have on a daily basis to play a video game. I cannot just sit and create things + spend money on the mats. Just my opinion, but crafting is a waste of time unless you have a lot of gold and even more time.

Saylah

@Hunter...GW2 is where it's at and I can't wait for it to release. GW1 is too static for my tastes. Except for the cities where players gather, the whole game is instanced. And you're restricted as to where you can actually go in the landscapese by invisible barriers which I found very annoying. Regardless, the sights are breath-taking.

I did like being able to quest solo by highering mercenaries to tag along but the world feels lonely because of the instancing. They guild halls are way cool but again, any time I went in ours it was empty.

I imagine that GW2, where it's more of an open world ala EQ and WOW will be more fun. If it turns out as nice as they've planned I'll try to subscribe right from the beginning and ride the wave of people leveling up and questing en masse.

Highlander

I never really played an MMORPG before playing WoW, so I wasn't experienced with other crafting systems.
But from what you've posted here it does seem that the crafting process in WoW could use an overhaul when it's compared to other existing ones.
I'm now tempted to play EQ and LotRO and see how it works in them and see what WoW is missing.
Maybe as a WoW profession guide writer I should have done that sooner, but to be honest, walking away from WoW and giving my time and money to another game is a tough decision.
I think I'll have to find some more info on other crafting systems.
Thank you for an interesting article and giving me something to think about.

Highlander
WoW EU Forum MVP

Saylah

@Highlander...Thank you for stopping by and commenting. What I love about EQ2 crafting, and it's something I think WOW could benefit from, is that it is an alternative end-game. Crafting in and of itself, contains enough merit and variety in a game like EQ2 that it is really a valid route for character development.

The first time I reached max level which was 60 at the time, I wished very much for a more robust crafting system that I could retire my character into. The vision of Vanguard would have had something along those lines, and that was what I was most interested in if things had worked out differently for that game.

However, I think that the click and go crafting in WOW is probably what the majority of players want, given that I've not see any sustained forum requests for anything more robust. It would be wonderful though if they could put in something that could cater to those of us who want more, much like the raiding content, that doesn't exactly serve the player majority.

Saylah

My son had three max characters before TBC and he always had more gold than me. In the beginning I would give him gold to twink a bit, but once he hit 60 he was always rolling in gold. AND HE NEVER HAD A SINGLE PROFESSION. He didn't like crafting, doesn't do grinding so other than first aid which he didn't level at all on his Paladin, he had no professions.

Conversly, I maxed out everything on my main, including the fishing and cooking. Damn I wish they'd make cooking a primary profession already. And for all that effort, I never made or had the amount of gold my son had on his characters.

I like crafting as part of my character development. I just want something more to it - both value to me as a player, fun as a player and some RP incentive. And I get that the masses don't want that, but I'm still hoping that they can somehow cater to both.

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